Thanks for the info and advice. We are definitely going with a machine torch head and the auto height adjustment. I looked at the CG site but could not find pricing. How big a step up are we talking about?

I have owned two PlasmaCams over five years. I cannot agree that they are the “toys” described earlier. I find mine to be sturdy and well built for less than industrial applications. The software is superior and easy to learn! It is just darn good!

I like the fact that the PlasmaCam uses a hand torch. It means your plasma cutter can be used in both machine and hand held applications. You can get or make a very simple torch holder that makes the hand held function much like the machine torch.

The height control works nicely.

The biggest drawback might be the 4’x 4’ table. In my case it is an advantage as my shop space is limited. I have cut hundreds of 4’x8’ sheets by simply “indexing” them. I would prefer, had I the space, to get a 4'x8' table. PlasmaCam now offers an 8’ table under a different trade name. Call ‘em as I don’t recall the name. Their support desk is now very good after some earlier problems.

Anyway, There are other good outfits offered in this class, but probably more PlasmaCams than others so they'll be around awhile. Suffice it to say I’d buy another PlasmaCam without out a seconds thought.

DumOleBob

A shop I work with a lot bought a Plasmacam unit and for what they paid for it - they could have done much better.

It can't be made any lighter or cheaper and still last for a several cuts. Keep looking!

Thanks for the input. After more research I think we are going with the Dynatorch. Seems to be better constructed and supported.

Interesting observation and I don't mean to be adversarial, but different tools come up different stress in any given shop.

All I can speak to is my personal experience at having owned, and extensively used a PlasmaCam for over five years. I've yet to have ANY issue related to it not being strong enough, not being well built, and I’ve used mine for probably over ten thousand, cuts. The software is excellent. I have always found their support to be excellent.

So there you go. Different stroke as it were, but PlasmaCam is NOT a squirrelly tool that some, with no practical hands on experience, might lead us to believe.
Bob

Thanks Bob for the input. We want all the info we can get before we take the plunge. Any thoughts or experience with Dynatorch?

hi,
not sure if dynatorch / dynaCNC are the same, but My dynaCNC witch I was very frustrated with at first, but I had never run any sort of cad or cam program and now I use correldraw9 for the cad, ha, ha, it works... and well for me. the unit came with sheetcam, that was easy to learn rite off the tutorial.
anyway no problems with the machine, I've had it a little over a year, and Ive done well over 10k cuts. and it just keeps going. I use the hypertherm powermax 1000, at first I was using my powermax 600 and HAD to upgrade (do not cheat yourself get the 1000 way less headache). also the machine torch just unplugs and your using the machine with a hand torch in seconds. and the consumables interchange.
Matt

OK Bob, come clean, you either own PlasmaCam stock or your screen name is suitable? (hey you picked it not me..)

The shop I work with had a problem with their control box - 2 times. It was sent back, returned, sent back returned etc.

The last time it failed (in 3 weeks) the drives took off and flew the gantry across the table so hard that the gantry twisted about 30 degrees. After some work with a pair of channelocks, the gantry was twisted back into shape. For the last couple of weeks it has been working better.. I guess 3 times is a charm?? But the bearings are way to small, the frame way to light. If you dropped a 1/4" plate on it from any distance at all - a bunch of stuff will bend out of shape permanently.

Before you buy one - go look at one and tell me how they could have made it any cheaper or more flimsy. I don't think it would be possible. Perhaps steel costs a lot more where these are made then they do in Midwest USA, or else the PlasmaCam dudes are just plain cheap?

I think the shop paid about $9K for the table with no PC or Plasma cutter. They could have done so much better for about the same or less cost.

But if you like the videos and think the paint is pretty - go for it. Just remember that Tonka uses heavier sheetmetal in their big dumps that my kids used to play with.. (;->)

If you have a PlasmaCam I'd sell it on Ebay and then drop your Ebay account so they can't hunt you down!

It is worthwhile to hear differing reports on such equipment, but if you feel so strongly about the PlasmaCam, why don't you put your name on your comments? Since you suggested that Bob was affiliated with PlasmaCam, it would seem only fair to ask if someone is paying *you* to make these claims and insult people like Bob who is satisfied with the machine.

You said, "If you dropped a 1/4" plate on it from any distance at all - a bunch of stuff will bend out of shape permanently."

I cannot imagine how anyone could expect a precision plotter system to withstand such abuse, regardless of manufacturer. Are you in the habit of dropping heavy plate on your plotter? That might explain some of the issues that your shop has had with its PlasmaCam.

Feel free to voice your opinion on equipment, but please don't make insulting comments about other people. ArtMetal isn't the place for that stuff.

Rich Waugh
Moderator

Rich,

You are right. I should not have pointed out that DumOleBob chose to make his screen name resemble an insulting comment. I have no idea why he chose that name..?? Any ideas?
I apologize DumOleBob.

However I feel that DumOleBob has made some serious mistakes when purchasing not one, but two Plasma Cam cutting machines.

The shop I work with is very typical of many smaller midwestern Rust Belt shops - they fab up whatever they can to generate revenue, make custom machines when possible etc. They are one of the few remaining shops that I know of that is making money.

The shop owner obtained a copy of Plama Cams video and took the hook and bought a unit. What he got differed from what he thought he was going to get. Somehow it looks much more robust in the video. The frame is lightweight steel - formed into shapes on a press brake. The light weight keeps the shipping costs down which makes sense. Beyond that, everything possible to cheapen the construction has been done. But they have clearly crossed the line between economy and junk. I can clearly state that IMO if you buy a Plasma Cam unit, you are making a big mistake. Do yourself a favor and look at one before buying it. Then send me $20 for keeping you from making a huge mistake! (;->)

Working with steel is heavy work and sometimes things get bumped and drops occur. This Plasmacam table was meant to be put to work cutting .1 to .75 steel primarily, however the table is way too flimsy. I'd very very concerned if someone put a 4x4 plate of .75 steel on the table in fear that it might collapse. Dropping a 1/4 - 4x4' plate from a couple of inches is a definite possibility. Cut enough plate and it will definitely occur. I'd be fearful that the table would simply collapse or bend out of shape if that occurred. It's that lightweight.

Here are some major deficiencies that I have discovered.

Proprietary controls - everything is sealed up. If after the warranty if you blow the control box (this shop is on #3) the cost to replace is $3500 I have been told.

The framework and gantry are pressed steel - you can flex it by hand. Not good.

Linear bearings - there are none. The slide bearings are very small - about 5/8" diameter and they ride on the edges of the pressed steel framework. I predict that they will last for less than a year around the grit and dust created by the plasma process. The engineering is very clever - it was very clever that they could make this thing work with such cheap components. Like I said - all cost has been wrung out of this table.

The table does not accommodate a machine torch - they use a goofy clamp to adapt a hand torch - it works - just don't try and adjust it afterwards - screws are behind brackets and not accessible without disassembly. I guess you could make one - but for $9K couldn't they include that?

No covers - all of the slide bearing (read little cheap bearings smaller than skate bearings) are totally exposed - also there are no covers over the belt reduction drives. The belt reduction drive bearings are also exposed. I guess that covers cost money and they were not absolutely required - so no covers.

Servo Motor - no labels on anything. If PlasmaCam goes belly up and you blow a motor - good luck finding one.

Torch height control - the plate sensor switch is a wire that hangs down from the torch height carriage and touches the plate you want to cut - better keep that wire bent in the right way or else it may not make the circuit - yes that is correct there is no switch - that would cost money and after all you only paid $9,000 dollars for your Plasma Cam right? And you expected an actual switch? Come on.....

So say you want to cut some slightly rusty steel - whoops - bare wires don't work very well on rusted steel. That's ok as the torch will smack the steel plate and keep it from running off it's tracks which are by the way - raw steel edges running on - little grooved rollers.

THC faults - torch dives into holes. If that little wire hits a hole while going down the find the surface the torch will wack the plate. The shops solution is to hang may small wires down so the chances of this happening is less.

Wire handling - The torch cables and motor cables hang from a tube that projects above the table. Simple but laying a piece of plate on the table with an overhead crane is tough, the cable hanger gets in the way - I'm sure that if Plasmacam could have gotten by with dragging the cables across the table they would have done that, but for 9K they threw in that piece of tubing so you can hang the cables up!

No provisions for a water table or ventilation. - Grab your dust mask when using this table - plasma cutting makes a lot of gritty dust and smoke. Plan on making a water table and adding ventilation!

Table grid/grate - now this is a really clever situation. The side rails support the table which is made up from laser cut sheet steel. When you burn up the table - and you want to replace the laser cut sheet steel interlocking pieces.. I'm sure that PlasmaCam will be happy to send you more for a price.

Points on the table grid - they put little points on the table so you can position your part and cut around the points. This works great until the part you cut falls out and tips on the points and the torch gets jammed on the fallen part. And when you accidentally burn off a point then you can call PlasmaCam for more laser cut sheetmetal to replace little points.

Good things about the Plasma Cam.

Paint - the paint job is really nice - no joke. I think it is powercoat and it is a nice shade of blue. If you want to buy a plasma table for a status symbol - like you're the only guy on the block with a plasma table, then this is a really good thing.

Phone - they do answer the phone so when you blow a control box or two you can send them back and get another one.

All in all the Plasma Cam unit is really a marvel. It's absolutely amazing to me that a company can make a machine like the Plasma Cam, with such flimsy components, and sell it with glitzy adds and videos for about $9K. It simply blows my mind to see such companies produce such products.

The shop owner has done a good job in kicking himself around the shop whenever the topic of the PlasmaCam comes up. His most recent comment was that he has discovered that he could have bought a "real" 4x8 plasma cutter for less than 20K. Actually he is mistaken - many are available for less than that.

I read another comment on the web about PlasmaCam tables and one guy said - you may buy one Plasmacam but you will never buy a second one...... Now I understand why.

FWIW, I am not affiliated in any way with any Plasma Cam or their competitors at this time. I do industrial control work for this particular shop and have done so for 4 years.

I invite everyone to tell me where I am wrong on any of these points.

Dave from Ohio

Now I know why I decided to just buy a plasma cutter and forget the table - I too had done lots of research on most of the brands out there only to come across other discussion forums like this particular thread where people either liked, hated, or loved the machine they use. My head was just spinning and it was too difficult to make a decision with so much different types of feedback.

Not trying to add fuel to this metal fire, but just felt like I had to confirm to myself why I decided to go the freeform way with my plasma cutter(which I finally bought! - a Miller 625) and go tableless.

Metal Momma - metal art everlasting

Dave,

Now that's the sort of post that is really useful to someone looking into getting a plasma cutter. You enumerated your objections to the PlasmaCam with detailed information that anyone can personally verify by lookng at the actual machine, and make their own decision based upon real data. Thanks!

Rich Waugh

Metal Momma.... just because it can be a little difficult to choose a good plasma table doesn't mean that plasma cutting tables are not a good idea. Even a PlasmaCam can do some nice cuts that are impossible by hand if you want to be exact. I just think that the PlasmaCam is a poorly constructed machine and is a poor choice and I'm baffled as to how they are able to sell any machines at all. I'm advantaged in that I have been working on industrial control systems, motion control, PLC, and PC based systems for over 25 years so it took me about 10 minutes to realize that the machine was poorly constructed. Compared to anything "industrial", the PlasmaCam is a joke. The PlasmaCam machine is a hobby grade machine at best.

Just keep looking, there are better machines out there for about the same price.

Dave from Ohio

First of all, thank you for your input on PlasmaCam, I work in a shop that currently uses a PlasmaCam and am considering opening my own shop. I can't speak for anyone else but the PlasmaCam we use has broken down numerous times causing us to be out of work while we wait on the replacement parts. They're version of Digital Torch Height Control is a joke and while the machine is running I am scared to look away for five minutes in fear that the two guides on the bottom are going to hit the plate and throw the whole sheet off. The machine does not take well to the grit and we have had to replace the gears on the carriage twice.

I do not know much about plasma cutting or plasma cutting tables but I do know I would never buy a PlasmaCam. Can you give me some suggestions on a plasma cutter if I want to cut about .11" stainless steel? Also, what kind of cutting table should I buy if I'm going to cut about 3 or 4 sheets of 4x4' plate a day? Sorry if my questions are hard to understand, like I said, I don't know much about plasma, just know not to get PlasmaCam.
Thanks,
Ryan

just got something in the mail from SamsonCNC.com looks like a nice plasma machine

I'm a metals teacher in Illinois, and I have to say that I feel sorry for Dave, he must have gotten a lemon. Because our students have had nothing but productive success with our machine... And i feel that after 3 years of use, lots of student abuse,and a couple thousand cuts. Our machine has since proved itself worthy of being a great investment...

Are there better machines out there on the market, Absolutely...But we like ours and have had no problems or complaints...Two of our students actually put the thing together and learned the software within a few days...So if two 16 year olds can figure out how to use the PlasmaCam, anyone can...We've even made over $2000 dollars in the past few years selling artwork in various forms...

Although I do not recommend the PlasmaCam for industrial use, there are some drawbacks.(Size and build) I have found it to be an Incredible and effective learning tool, and one that withstands student abuse over and over again...These kids love computer aided machines, and having the PlasmaCam in their learning environment has improved their awareness to where metal fabrication is going in the future...

Take it for what its worth, but customer support, the machines durability, and its incredible user friendly system, I would highly recommend the PlasmaCam to anyone...

Thank you PlasmaCam!!!

Clay

www.dragonflymetalworx.comwww.dragonflymetalworx.com This a very interesting thread, I have been doing metal work for about 5 years now, a couple of years ago I saw a plasma cam in Fabricator mag, got thier video and was impressed @ first until i got serious and did more investigating#1 the whole 4'x4' wa sdefantly not the way to go,even though you can index the piece of metal if you are working alone a 1/4" 4'x8' sheet is kida heavy, secondly when talking to them about the machine, they acted like it was a bother to give what little info they did.
Then I found a company called Practical cnc I talked w/ the owner several times and the within a few hours notice he got a flight to one of thier customers who was closest to me and spent the day showing me the macine that actually blew me away! my machine was only alittle more than the plasma cam and here was the owner flying to give me a demo!(I'm in florida they are in michigan)and the customer support has been unbelievable every since!I had a problem early on w/the table and again he flew down immediatly for the day a fixed it! The table is great I have a couple of friends who have machine over 100k and they are no better and my software is great too. My friends with the 100k plus table were like you cant use Corel Draw for that blah blah blah well they were wayyyyy wrong I do things on my table in minutes that take them hours.
Well anyway I'm about to buy another table from them if that says anything (this one will be router only) and all of thier tables are modular and upgradeable so I can add a tool changer ect. down the line
Anyway this was just my thoughts on the matter my #s are on my website and i've been around these machines for a while if anyone has any questions.
Joe DeLoach

Just joined in and good info. I have a small shop and mostly work in aluminum. I would like a machine that could use either a plasma torch or a router. Ideas?
Dan@aluminations

I went to buy a cnc plasma cutter & router combination from Practical CNC they took my monies.Yes $39,721.92 trying to find others who have been cheated also. They talk good & impressive web site so buyers beware. I know thier website & phones are down now but I believe they may start up agian as an differnent company.

Your machine doesn't work very much. If you are only doing a few thousand cuts every three years then maybe it is the machine for you. If a fab shop only cut two thousand parts every three years they would go broke in a month.

I have been researching plasma tables for a couple months. I agree Torchmate and Plasma Cam leave a bit to be desired with function and look. I found an advert for a CNC Cutting Machine and they have Plasma Cutting tables too. Their table is chromed out and looks great! I have a friend in Alabama who has one and they said it's great. I am planning to go down to see it soon and hopefully put my order in shortly after. Anyway, you can see pictures on the site-it's www.cnccuttingmachines.com -wondering what others think of the look!

I just found this forum. I wish I had found it sooner.

Too bad you have to make demeaning remarks about people who disagree with you. That certainly hurts your credibility.

Your are wrong in your statement that the controller "is $3500 you've been told". Please get your facts straight. A new controller can be purchased for $1995. That's not cheap but it is not unreasonable. Repair rate for out of warranty controller is $498.

We have machines in service that are 8 years old. The design is rigid and is stronger than you make it out to be. It is designed for the light industrial market and will handle up to 1" plate.

The replacement parts list for the machine are on our website. You don't have to buy the parts from us. Most of the parts have the manufacturers part number on them and you can cross reference them and buy them locally. The motors can be found at a couple of sources.

The Material sensing uses the standard ohmic torch consumables. Unfortunately not all of the plasma cutter manufacturers have ohmic consumables. The homemade sense tab is only for the cutters that do not have the ohmic parts available. Have you ever used a material sensing plasma cutter before. The cut height is then adjusted by the arc voltage of the torch. That does have to be calibrated to the brand and model of torch.

Did you not see the cut files that were included to make panels to make a downdraft vent system?

We certainly do not force anyone to buy the grates. Some plasma tables supply grates as an option. We supply the grates so that you can start cutting right away. You have a Plasmacam and you can cut your own. You can copy the pattern or make a completely different style.

Anyway, we can only help the customers who ask us. I don't know why insulting remarks were made about the school teacher. Dozens of schools have the Plasmacam and he is right that teens (boys and girls) can run the Plasmacam. It is because they are teachable.

So, if you own a Plasmacam and need assistance, call us.

Regards,
George
Plasmacam Support.

Hi George, Dave from Ohio here.
Thanks for clarifying the new and replacement cost of the controller. I was told $3500. Good. For the sake of the Plasmacam users I'm glad it is less than I expressed - $2000 for a new one and $500 to rebuild. Not hardly cheap though..

If you blow a driver on your competitors units you can usually replace just the driver, not the entire box. Did you know that?

>>design is rigid and is stronger than you make it out to be

George I can twist the grid support angles with my hands. Rigid, or do you mean not that flexible?? There is absolutely nothing industrial about this unit. I would consider it a hobby to light commercial art grade machine at best.

>>You have a Plasmacam and you can cut your own.

I don't think so. You guys have them laser cut. Why don't you use PlasmaCams to cut them?? Heck fire up a Samson (bigger Plasmacam POS) and make them.
>>I don't know why insulting remarks were made about the school teacher.

Who made insulting remarks about the teacher? No one I can see. I simply said that I thought that DumOleBob made a really stupid decision in buying not one, but two Plasmacams. He could have picked any screen name that he wanted and he chose DumOleBob. Nuf said.

Plasmacam:
The machine is junk and I'm amazed that people buy them. But a lot of people bought Yugos also I guess. George you have great job security!

And yes the company I work for has called Plasmacam tech support many times and replaced the control box twice while in warranty and they still beat themselves over the head for buying the machine. The box started to flake out again recently so they turned it off and the weather cooled down and now it doesn't seem to flake out nearly as much.

They use the machine maybe 2 hours per week. During that two hour period it will skip cuts, drag the tip around, etc. The THC has never worked right. Now I see that the PlasmaCam has a new and improved THC. Does that mean that it actually works???

The software is pretty hostile to use and very simplistic. Not at all Windows like. The guy that runs the machine has incredible patience with the machine and that is the only reason that one of the guys hasn't totally lost it with that machine and taken a cutting torch to it. (Seriously)

Have they made some money with the machine - yes. Is it better than not having a CNC Cutting machine. Yes. Could they have chosen a much better machine for about the same $ - most definitely. I suspect that they will keep the machine for maybe one more year (it is just over a year old) and then it will be sold (or they will drop the machine off at their competitors shop and let them waste their time with the machine) and they will buy a real light industrial CNC Plasma Cutting machine. This machine is not it.

One more thing, the PlasmaCam users group on Yahoo only allows actual owners of PlasmaCam machines into the group.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Plasmapig/

Hmmm.... I wonder why they would want to have new potential customers communicate with existing customers???
Ask questions about the machine etc. The forum is moderated so its not like they don't already have control of the forum .... George can you explain why you don't want potentially new customers talking to existing customers?

And yes, the Yahoogroup name is "Plasmapig" - seems sort of approapriate.

And why is the Samson CNC machine not marketed as a larger PlasmaCam machine?? Not trying to hide anything are we??
I mean if the PlasmaCam is so darn good, why wouldn't the 4x8 big brother of the PlasmaCam be marketed on the same website?? It's pretty much the same machine just bigger.

Dave from Ohio

I'd like to mention a blog on another site that is very specific to the DVD put out by PlasmaCam. I thought the site had some very good info on Plasma Cam - this guy explains almost section by section what his view of the video is - some of you may have already found this.

http://onemansblog.com/2007/02/07/plasmacam-video-review-fact-vs-fiction/

Metal Momma - metal art everlasting

Hi All,
You can use Capacitive Sensor with your Torchmate to stop diving and prevents crash.Cap01 can be used with or without THC for plasma and Oxy-fuel cutters respectively.
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