Thanks for the reply, Jim! I chose core ten b/c the thing I'm making will be attached to a floating platform installed (I hope) in a saltwater environment. The steel part functions as a gong of sorts, and after running some tests on pipes of various ilks, 1/4" sheet steel, and 1/8" core ten (not that this was a scientific survey—it was just what the welder could get his hands on), the core ten won. As far as I can tell, core ten is also an appropriate material for the conditions the instrument will be living in.

All that said, I am open to any other suggestions you (or anyone!) may have about other, easier-to-source materials that would hold up in a watery environment and might sound good, too.

Thanks!

LS

LS, here's a suggestion: I am also in NYC , perhaps you can contact someone at Socrates Sculpture Park in Long Island City. It's the pet project of Mark DeSuevero. I'm sure there's some corten steel to be had there. Try them.
Also try Eastern Steel in Brooklyn for a small order you might have to go there and pick it up. Last but not least try some scrap metal dealers. Good luck. Janet R.

Thanks very much for the ideas, Janet!

I don't know about carrying your scrap on a subway... or what shapes your tinking of, but those steel welding tanks when out of ate need to be discarded and they do it by cutting them open. Same with oxygen tanks from a dive shop and many others. Thing being they have a fabulous ring as gongs go. It is legally something they have to do, and then discard as junk. Check out the junk yards or even the welding suppliers for locations. Cutting them open is another specific test and they could also blow up if done wrong so if not sure, don't chance that part but I have cut open about 18 so far safely by uncapping and filling with water while it is being cut.

I am an architect in Ottawa Canada and am using Corten for a portion of my house and sourced a small section from the A588 and A572 Steel Co (http://www.a588a572steel.com/) in PA. Good luck.

I am interested to see your use of corten ... I have a studio near Almonte ... can I visit ?

Where to bend next ... www.metalgarden.ca

Hey Reis, thanks *very much* for the info.

L

sorry, meant *Ries*!

Ries, What clear coat product are you referring to? I also was looking for cor-ten but it seems like, from the many comments, that if i am going to get this project done, i would be better off with a more accessible material. Thanks in advance for a reply. Rich

Ries,
It sounds like you have experience using cor-ten. May I ask in what capacity you have worked with it? I am currently conserving a large cor-ten sculpture and would be interested to talk with you about the development of rust coatings. Please contact me privately at merdmann@ica-artconservation.org.

Haven't had much luck—if you want to keep in touch, drop me a line at schmittpod@gmail.com. We can share info. Are you in NY?

LS

I don't read this discussion group, but was looking into some other issues relating to Corten and stumbled upon it.

Reading the threads on the quest for finding a source for some Corten, I have a few comments.

I've never heard of the aluminum or the stainless steel alloys mentioned to have very good "gong" characteristics... This is usually the realm of steels and bronzes...

Someone made a comment about letting steel rust and then clear coating it. I have heard this comment many times, especially in the artistic communities dealing with sculptures.

However, I highly recommended against it. Iron oxide is a porous oxide that contains a lot of adsorbed water within the oxide itself that has not reacted in the oxidation process. Unless you have developed a method of removing that prior to coating, and that would be very difficult, this will not result in a satisfactory method of protection. The existing water simply gets sealed under the clear coat and promotes what is called under-deposit pitting corrosion...

I will also make the observation that the sound quality of a particular metal is highly artisanal. It comes from how the metal has been worked and heat treated. And it is anything but simple in creating a "good" sounding piece. Neither have I ever found any "formulas" that consistantly work...

Although you may have found an example of Corten that sounded great, you may have a difficult time of reproducing that sound. I would suggest starting with an easy to find alloy and then work on developing it's sound quatlity...

for what's it's worth..

Good luck to you.

dj

Hello all. I am a designer working in London. Along with many others I am finding it difficult to get information on Corten. I want to use it to form a short 650mm (25.59inches)high retaining wall for a raised flower bed in a courtyard garden. There will be 450mm (17.71inches) above ground, the remainder would be set in concrete. The wall or steel sheet will be 8mm (0.31inch) thick and approx 5260mm (207inches) long. There will be straps welded on, attaching the wall at intervals to the brick wall behind the sheet. The courtyard is to be paved in stone but there is a linear drain directly in front of the wall, seperating it from the stone, so staining should not be a big issue. I am after a very thin structure, that is strong enough to hold the earth and plants, hence steel. The bed will be 900mm (35.4inch)at one end and narrow to 245mm (9.64inch) at the other. Also a rich colour and then the weathering properties are attractive. I briefly looked into Bronze but the prices are prohibitive. I have a small building firm doing the work, they know nothing about Corten but they happen to have an expereinced welder in their team although he has never worked with Corten (I think he has spent 2 years welding safes in Germany!). Am I mad to be persuing this avenue? I would like a really rich dark patina, not a bright rust colour. Is a good treatment a mild solution of sulphuric acid when the fabrication is complete and then rinse thouroughly. Wait a few years for a patina to develop and then and then apply Owatrol Oil? Can welding the sheets be done sensibly on site (worried about power needed)? Can I recomend the welding rods suggested in earlier posts for this application. I imagine spot welding on the rear for the sheets. Each will be just over 1 meter long. Can anyone help. Thanks, confused of London

there are many attractive ways to join sheets without welds ( welds always colour differently when weathering so they are not subtle )

drop me an email if you need more help

giusseppe

Where to bend next ... www.metalgarden.ca

Personally, I would never set Cor-Ten in concrete. It will rot in the concrete in short order due to the chemistry of the concrete. A flower bed retaining wall means water, and that means the CorTen will be drooling great nasty streaks of rust all over the place. Ugly.

This sounds like a good place to use bronze, copper or stianless steel. As Guiseppe said, 304L Stainless can be given a pretty darn stable rust finish that won't drool all over the landscape below. I still wouldn't recommend directly embedding it in concrete; rather, I would core drill anchor holes and embed in epoxy.

Stianless steel can be welded on site just fine by any knowledgeable welder with the right equipment.

Thanks to Giusseppe and Rick for your advise. I have taken it and am now building the retaining wall out of concrete block which will have a galvanised or stainless steel L shaped angle fixed to the top. The front of the wall will then be clad in a powdercoated sheet in (syntha pulvin or similar quality finish in bronze colour). I think I shall need to to powdercoat the rear of the sheet too if it is aluminium or use galvanised steel instead as the back will be touching the concrete. The cladding will then be bent over the angle to give the appearance of a very thin wall when the raised bed is backfilled and toped with pebbles.

Thanks again,
Dycella